StoneFly Nymphs...How Small Do You Tie Them?

[pmjasper]

Hi guys. I was looking through some books on stonefly nymph patterns and saw that most were tied in a larger sizes. Over this past fall and winter, I seined some stoneflies out of two local streams in NJ and besides getting the large giant black stoneflies, typically seen and tied in pattern books, I also captured what appeared to be smaller #16 and #14 golden stoneflies on the one stream and what appeared to be #20 black stoneflies on the other. I was just curious on how small you guys tie up your stonefly immitations and if there may be a reason for using the larger patterns versus the small. Thanks

[nutman]

the real small stone fly you found should be hatching in the near future ,and would be good in a size 20 nymph to fish now .Im trying to think of the name of the pattern it escapes me at the moment ,but it was a small bead head with black goose byot feathers with a red head,I like to fish that with a caddis nymph .it is only a good winter pattern till about febuary. at least it was for me .the golds i always tied in 14 an16 sometimes 12 .what streams where you on ?if you dont mind me asking the musky is full of those black stones

[AaronJasper]

For little black stonefly nymphs I am a fan of the black Copper John in small sizes.

[nutman]

im still home sick today so you gave me some homwork,i looked up the pattern iwas thinking of "it is called the north fork special ,winter 2003 issue of fly tyer" it has a silver bead head ,ten wraps of tungsten on a 14 size nymph hook two black goose biots for the tail ,black dubbed body,with red wire "thin" wrapped over the top segmented,to a dubbed and picked thorax,with three biots folded and layed on top of each other in a rowbut with a small amount of dubbing inbetween each wing wrapped off at the bead head .it is a killer for this time of year for black stones ,and the trout love them

[pmjasper]

The waters I sampled were the Big Flat Brook and a lesser known water called Wawayanda Creek. The #20 to #22 stoneflies (found in the creek) were so small, it was hard to determine the exact species, however, the distinct features of the stonefly could be seen. I found them mixed in with a few micro mayflies in the same size range. Since purusing the fly catalogs, I never see tiny stonefly imitations, probably because they can be mimicked with generic nymph patterns, but was wondering if anyone takes the time to tie a more distinct stonefly pattern in a smaller size.

The golden stones on the BFB I found were almost as abundant as the mayflies I found in the same location. Both the mayfly nymphs and the golden stones were common in the #16-#12 size, with more stoneflies being found my last trip out. Both nymphs (the mayflies and stones) look similar execpt for coloration and the stone seems to have longer antennae. I tied up a few small golden stonefly patterns over the weekend and hope to try them out in the near future.

[AaronJasper]

I make Golden Stones down to a size 14. Sometimes depending on how many small ones are doing "behavioral drift" on any given that might be your best pattern hands down. Sometimes the larger ones work very well. Most anglers forget that Stoneflies are a 3 year life cycle insect. This means that there are many different size Stonefly nymphs available to the trout.

[nutman]

i guess you could be as creative as you want in small sizes ,i have a couple of scuds and micro shrimp in size 20&22 ,i think tying stone flys to small might be a real pain anyway,they have a bit to them .I like the copperjohn aswell because you can change the colors now with color wire .but i do like that north fork special you can find it by typing in north fork special fly and it shows what it looks like on ebay ,good luck pmjasper hope you have luck on the big flatbrook that is a beautiful river this time of year. I use to almost live in those woods out there.

[Nymphmeister]

I tie Golden Stones from #6-#14, with #8-10 my most used sizes. It is not uncommon to find small Goldens in the #14-16 range when flipping rocks, and at moments they can be very effective. When water is high/dirty or it is near the emergence time, I fish the bigger sizes. Some of the other Stonefly species are pretty small, and you certainly could try to imitate them. Personally I've had much better luck using small Pheasant Tails & Hare's Ears to imitate them in the smallest sizes, and then you are also covering the base of imitating a smaller Mayfly at the same time.

[pmjasper]

Thanks guys. I figured that a generic nymph might be a better imitation for the smaller stoneflies and mayflies but figured I'd ask anyway.

This winter I've tried to tie some of the smaller micro mayfly patterns and figured I'd add some smaller stoneflies as well. To date, I've probably had more fun on the BFB flipping over rocks and stirring up the bottom, seeing what insects abound in certain sections of rivers. The crawler mayfly nymphs and the golden stones look pretty similar in size and general shape, with tails, antenna and color differing. I'm trying my best to match the color of the golden stones I have seen recently. They appear to have a dark brown body, brownish gold motted wing cases and a pale yellow gray undeside. The ones I have tied look more like regular brown stoneflies than golden stones but I have more time to try and perfect a pattern. Then there are species such as the giant black stonefly that are very distinctive. I even managed to catch a crayfish which surprised me as well. Trying my best to tie up some patterns that imitate the insects I have found in the stream and that will help me catch a few trout. Thanks again all.

[SlowNDeep]

PM,
Dont know if you saw the other thread; here is a link to a simple Golden Stone pattern

http://www.troutpredator.com/Aaron's...ldenStone2.htm

One of my best winter patterns in sizes 12 and 14