Honestly I've been tying them with Olive Scud Back. Very much like the Vladi.. Changing thread color to adjust the shade of Olive(Black,Brown,Olive,White). Dubbing or using a Sharpie for the head area. Same for my Crane Fly larva but bigger. Could'nt beleive the size those larva are, the one's I found this winter were as long as my pinkie finger and almost as big around...Huge!