When Trout Feed

[Soft-hackle]

Hi, The post by HJFred was quite interesting and still is at progresses.

I was wondering if anyone noticed any trend or conditions when trout feed more/better. I've read some interesting ideas regarding this subject, and by looking at my diary of many years have noticed a few things. I was hoping someone might just find some of the same things I do.

Mark

[SlowNDeep]

[quote author=Soft-hackle link=topic=3182.msg23685#msg23685 date=1243982217]...by looking at my diary of many years have noticed a few things. I was hoping someone might just find some of the same things I do.[/quote]

What did you notice?

[NJFred]

Great question... I think I would respond to perhaps 1/2 of it... when do they feed on, in or near the surface. The second cavaet is wild fish in rich systems. I've seen numbers suggesting that upwards of 90% of feeding is down sub surface but I'm most interested in those feeding on top.

First thought is that trout come up when there is more food (e.g. hatch of spinner fall) at or near the surface than below. In order for a trout to expend the energy of rising and to place themselves a greater risk for predators their has to be a payoff. That payoff is more food, more energy more growth.

They also therefore have to recognize the bugs at or near the surface as food. Often when a new hatch begins it can take them a couple of days to recognize it. They probably also first key in on ascending nymphs in the lower part of the water column as well so often they don't rise right away.

Certainly low light can make a huge difference to their willingness to rise, overcast days early and late in the day. Part of this is the fish presents less of target to overhead predators... the other part of this is that bugs wings don't dry as fast and ride the water for longer periods of time.

Clarity of water does matter as well... not too clear not too dirty.

I've also seen where wind breaks up the top of the water and the fish seem less cautious regarding rising for food. Typically wind can work the opposite.

I think water temps do matter as well.

I'll add some more as things come to mind. Nice thread.

[LopatNympher]

his question goes out to anyone:
In Tom Rosenbauer's book, Prospecting For Trout he states that in less than optimum temps inactive trout need the stimulus of abundant food in order to begin feeding. One or two flies drifting past their noses won't be enough to get them started. Drawing from this, do you think that the repeated casts one makes while euro-nymphing would be a factor in stimulating inactive trout to begin feeding? Would this also be one of the reasons why this technique works so well? From my own experience I have noticed that more often than not it takes quite a few drifts before I get action from a particular run. Once the first one comes, the rest come rather quickly.

[AaronJasper]

A drop in barometric pressure almost always creates a feeding frenzy on any river or lake that I have fished.

What's strange is that trout react very differently to changes in water level. In some streams it makes for good fishing and on other streams it can totally shut the fishing off.

A drop in water level is always good.

Low light conditions are also very good.

Cloudy days usually are a signal of some change in the weather... usually a drop in air pressure so this would go along with my original assessment.

Behavioral drift surely creates a feeding frenzy underneath and I think that this is a major factor in trout not rising to hatches in the evening on our more fertile trout streams.

I don't know if stained water makes them feed anymore than they would in clear water as it works to improve our catch rates because the fish are more easily approached. Most food organisms that the trout eat are there regardless of water clarity.

[Soft-hackle]

Well, I've received a lot of great answers, and Aaron poses another good question.

Quite a number of years ago, I read an article written by Len Wright, Jr, about his finding as to when trout feed. His conclusions were based on wild trout living in the Neversink, to which he had access to on private land. During the period of his stay, he actually fed trout in the rough times, using lights (ground lungs). The fish rose to the lights as if it were hatching insects.

After intensive study, noticing that the trout didn't always feed readily, even to the free food he offered, he began to notice that as the water temperature approached 63 degrees from either the low side or the high side, the fish fed more readily.

Some may be surprised at more of his findings. In early spring and again in fall, the fish fed best on sunny days between 1PM and 4 PM. In bright mid-summer weather the best feeding occurred between 11AM and 12:30 PM, and again in the evening from 7PM till dark. On cloudy days, he found feeding only mediocre at best at all times of the year.

Back to temps. It took a 45 degree water temp to get trout to start feeding, and if the water temp hit 72, the trout shut down altogether. At 63 degrees he found that the trout's ability to extract dissolved oxygen was at it's highest. Also, the most insect activity occurred at 63 degrees as well.

His conclusions: Avoid cloudy, rainy days if you have any reasonable choice. Don't consult any charts that claim to predict good fishing times. They are no better than throwing a dart at the calendar. Don't feel that because fish have not been feeding well for two days, they must be starving. Trout, according to Wright, can go for months without food without showing signs of discomfort. Do take advantage of sunny High barometer days and dip your thermometer regularly to help determine your home river's best fishing times.

Since I read that article, I've done as Mr. Wright suggested and found his 63 degree benchmark pretty much accurate in predicting trout feeding sessions. Remember, the best time according to Wright, is when the temperature is rising or falling to 63 degrees. Also remember that these were wild trout, not freshly stocked. In the hatchery, the trout are fed in the morning and evening and get accustomed to feeding at those times, initially. I find that after a while, they feed more like their wild relatives. You may consider this a lot of BS, but give it a test and see what you find.

Aaron,
Your question is very intriguing. I've often heard of the theory of creating a false hatch, but have never tried it. By the way, I think the idea was also mentioned in A River Runs Through It . I think it was called "shadow casting".

Mark

[AaronJasper]

Mark,

What I was referring to is often times in the evening we don't see the trout feeding on the surface but I have stood in riffles and whacked trout one after another on nymphs. This fast and furious sub-surface fishing slows up after some pioint, which I can't put an exact time frame on. After this burst of action I then notice that the trout begin to feed on the surface.

The next logical thought would be that I was fishing with nymphs that represent the prevailing hatches. In fact to some extent yes, but the fly that took the most fish by a wide margin did not represent the hatching insects.

Did the behavioral drift cease and the trout had no choice but to feed on the surface or did the low light make them feel more comfortable and less vulnerable to predators? This is something that I am trying to put my finger on but I am sure that this is very situational and can go either way.

[Soft-hackle]

Sorry for the mix up, Aaron. I guess the question was posed by LopatNympher. "do you think that the repeated casts one makes while euro-nymphing would be a factor in stimulating inactive trout to begin feeding?" I'd say, it probably could.

Mark

[Davyfly]

softhackle,

I would myself agree a great deal with what Mr Wright said.
but with respect here also he did those studies on one particular river system and as we know they differ.
Take 3 examples of high and low temperature systems.
The San Juan which has very low average temps in he low 40s and the Firehole which has temps way up there, then we have spring creeks that may have a mean average from 52 to 56f.
Lake systems also differ, are they shallow or deep water bodies of water.

I may be wrong here but l did not see in any of the previous posts any reference to seasonal times of the year as this is very much related to food base activity.
During the winter periods much of the food base becomes dormant, which is also related to
lower water temperature, which in turn also

[Davyfly]

The site went stupid with me so to continue.

which in turn also coincides with lower water temps and way less activity from the trout, unless they are in a system and adapted to mean average water temps.
By and large those that are low in temperature will typically see chironomid, and may be small mayfly such as BWO.

As we move in to the Spring period we also see longer days of light and that is also a very important influence so far as trout feeding activity, particularly for Brown trout, as the rise in water temperature and the longer days of light are influential for invertebrate food sources to become active, in turn many of those go through the process of instar and we start to see hatches that will stimulate fish to food and by the very nature of that look more so for organisms within that body of water for longer periods of time.

Which is also interesting as fish hatcheries also calculate when and how much they will feed fish for optimum growth at given times of the year, again water temperature is a issue here, or at least one of them.

Hatcheries that are supplied with spring creek water of a mean average temp 52 to 26f have by far the best conversion rates of growth in less time for trout, may be as much as 10 ins for a Bow in 9 to 10 months.
My hatchery here at Norfork takes 20 months for Bows to attain 11 ins, due to longer periods of very cold water taken from the lake above the hatchery.

Hatcheries need a productive conversion rate for weight of food given, the provision of more food does not necessarily relate to faster growth rates.
Hatchery fish are dependant on food supplied while wild fish look for natural organisms, which are not always available 12 months of the year.

I used to at one time many years ago keep records of both water temps, daylight hours and at what time fish were active, which again was very much related to what l posted here.

No doubt at all that a hatch may stimulate fish to feed. On the other hand l have seen hatches that have promoted no interest from the fish above or below the water surface, particularly in the case of Brown trout, why that is so l have no answer other than l know that there will likely be a period in the day that they may feed.
However l do know that we may be able to stimulate a fish to take our fly at such times, particularly a fly that is moved, such as a wet/soft hackle or streamer, but not always.

In the case of Brown trout there is no question of doubt that during the longer days of light they do largely become nocturnal, which also coincides with the activity of the food sources they look for, particularly for systems that contain crustaceans and sculpins.

How many of you guys as a matter of interest go to the river one hour before sunrise, you might try it and be very surprised how good the fishing may be at this time.
Same also for the dusk to dark periods, if it is trophy Browns you are after.

Davy