The Results

Here are the results...

Day one beat one... or should I say beat 8... Blank

Day one beat two... beat 3... 1 stocker rainbow

Day two Lake... first place 13 fish

Day two lake... second place... actually a tie, so they will add up fish points to break the tie

So the river story.

No one caught a fish out of beat 8... so I was not the only one

In beat 3 I caught the only fish of the entire competition out of that stretch.

I had a good time but I don't think I will make a vacation out of this again. If the have a comp that
I can drive to I would do it again in a heartbeat. Going to this event is most likely going to result
in me not going to Montana this summer.

One of these days you'll have to explain to me what beat 1, beat 2, beat 3, etc. means. Nice job in any case. Watch out for puke on the flight home.

I think I speak for everyone when I say we are all very proud of you no matter how you finished.

Aaron,

You did great, it is not easy to get out there and put yourself on the line when it comes to competiton events, many may well talk about it but will never do it.

Davy

Great job on your first competition, actually getting first in a session against guys who are already on Team USA & have done this before. Impressive. Tough luck on getting crappy river beats, can't do anything about that, but you can take consolation that nobody caught one out of Beat #8, and you got the only fish in the other beat. Too bad they didn't have 4 river sessions instead of 2- at least that way the chances are you would get both good & bad beats, and it would all average out. That and it would be nice if they did it on a stream with wild trout, or at least if it was a stocked trout situation, make it far enough after stocking that the trout are basically holdovers.

Make sure you let us know as soon as they notify you if you made it to the finals in Pennsylvania.

Nutman-
"Beats" are sections of stream you get assigned to fish, typically maybe a 200 yard section, and you have 3 hours to extract as many fish as possible. Half the competitors fished the river Saturday, and half fished the lake out of a boat, with 2 anglers in each boat. Sunday it was reversed. The field of competitors was divided into 2 groups of 12 (I think).

Keep your chin up kid ;) Because of the luck of beat draw these comps aren't always about who's the best or not the best, but who shows up for the most comps to beat the draw. G.Daniels told me that after a tough river beat in Colorado.

Your saving grace is you might still qualify because of your lake showings. Last I looked there was nearly 6 or 7 team members competing at this comp. - since they are all ready qualified for finals their placings don't count. With 3 or 5 qualifying spots you really only need to beat out 10 or 7 other non team members. This should be one of the easiest comps to qualify this year. I could be completely wrong though.

I echo what Davy said though. Just getting there and putting your ego on the line is a win. Good job. Takes a few days, but wait until the yearning(aka addiction) sets in:)

A-

You put your money where your mouth is. A lot of us are living vicariously through your experiences. Getting your head handed to you only makes you better...and not for anything....all of the success you had there can't hurt either. An experience, regardless of the outcome, that you will never forget. Great job.

Its tough! There was nothing that I could have done in the river. I drew bad sections. I did the best of everyone on beat three with one measly little stocker rainbow. That was all that was caught between four skilled anglers. For that I consider myself lucky! On the other beat no fish were caught. I would call it getting my ass handed to me if people caught more fish than I did in those beats. I might have not placed well but its not the same as if I fished a beat and got one and the next guy tore them up. Putting together a good competition and winning requires a lot to say the least. I WILL do another one when I see a river that is more legitimate and requires more skill to catch the fish. The Rio Grande is weird. If there are no pike in your beat you will catch fish! They should have these comps on "non-pike" fisheries ;) In addtition to the pike wiping them out there were a lot of bait containers and spinning line along one of my beats. The controller was untangling the line that was trailing from my boots as I treaded upstream!!! It was a good time and I met some great individuals!

Yo, thats not a bad showing. I'm sure most of the competitors had fished there before. Way to represent, bro!

Aaron,

As l did say to you when you called me, rules and regulations for events should be made well and clear to all before the event, which allows for any complaints to be made against those who fished otherwise.

In so far as how those beats were divided, given what you told me l do believe that there should have been a little more consideration, that is of course not to say that event if fish were present that all who who fished those beats would have caught, as that is the name of the game, however a beat that is worthless from the get go is another issue.

Davy

I'm new here, but read up on your adventure to the rio grande. I saw bravo, good sir! It takes a lot of guts to do what you did and not everyone could handle the pressure like that. It seems like your success, or lack thereof, is mostly due to the situation, not your angling prowess. Give it a go, I would venture to say that your experience next time will be exponentially better.

I know exactly how you feel. I've had finishes very similar. I've found that you learn alot from the comps. If i were to get the chance to do over some comps i would have fished my beats differently to some respects. Another thing, as you will probably agree. Comps are so much more than fishing. The experience is priceless. The people you get to meet and the knowledge exchanged and the atmosphere of the whole event is just amazing.

Well at this time I am disappointed. They didn't even total up the scores? It looks very suspect to say the least... It was fun, but I am not gung ho like I was a month ago. If it was really a "qualifier" they would have done the scores already.

Before, during and after the NM competition, I could find zero information on-line about the event. It seems like the whole enterprise is really tight-lipped, exclusive and secretive. I do not understand why things are done this way.

We have also heard there are other qualifiers, but the FF USA web-site never has any useful current information.

I had the same problem Alan. I looked on several engines but the only information I found was from competitions that took place prior to 2007.

I was reading that there is another qualifyer comp in Michigan on May1rst
http://www.loopfly.net/2009/02/17/fl...-may-1-3-2009/

I am curious, is there a east coast/west coast rivalry in these comps?

Not sure about East -West rivalry Lopat, but my guess is that politics plays a significant role. I doubt that these things are as cut and dry as we would like to think they are. Just my opinion.

they didnt total up the scores correctly? can you contact someone about that?

Ernie: we don't know if they have totalled the scores at all, or assigned placings. No information is available.

Magnet: that link is a good find, thanks.

Alain,
I know. I was surprised to see it.
We shouldn't have to dig to find this stuff. They should want the top challengers to vie for a spot on Team USA.

In that case, I would contact someone who ran the contest and ask them what the deal was with the scoring/ranking. I would be even more furious if I spent all that time and money to get there and it wasnt run right.

FYI, I have been emailing back and forth with Anthony Naranja who appears to be running things. Here is what I've sent:

"Anthony,

Any idea when the New Mexico results will be out? The competition concluded over a week ago, right? I have been following along closely and I'm interested to find out how it turned out.

Thank you for your time in advance.

Justin Massimo"

Here is what I received back:

"When the scores are complete they will be released asap to everyone as well as on the website. Sorry for the delay as the scoring program had to be redone for 4 groups which we had in Santa Fe.

Thanks for your continued enthusiasm for Fly Fishing Team USA!

Regards,

Anthony"

I replied again, I'll let you know when I hear back. Don't worry, I have a way with harassing people in a very polite manner, thereby not allowing them to get annoyed without getting me what I want.

juice: thats how you gotta do it, kill em with kindness, and get what you want :)

After emailing back and forth a ton, it looks like the results will be out friday. Keep you all in the loop.

[quote author=AaronJasper link=topic=2858.msg21230#msg21230 date=1239144094]
Its tough! There was nothing that I could have done in the river. I drew bad sections. I did the best of everyone on beat three with one measly little stocker rainbow. That was all that was caught between four skilled anglers. For that I consider myself lucky! On the other beat no fish were caught. I would call it getting my ass handed to me if people caught more fish than I did in those beats. I might have not placed well but its not the same as if I fished a beat and got one and the next guy tore them up. Putting together a good competition and winning requires a lot to say the least. I WILL do another one when I see a river that is more legitimate and requires more skill to catch the fish. The Rio Grande is weird. If there are no pike in your beat you will catch fish! They should have these comps on "non-pike" fisheries ;) In addtition to the pike wiping them out there were a lot of bait containers and spinning line along one of my beats. The controller was untangling the line that was trailing from my boots as I treaded upstream!!! It was a good time and I met some great individuals!
[/quote]

From what I can tell you get the beats you get. I believe no one is spared from a bad day with some of the worst waters. I don't see pike or sucker waters being less legitimate just harder. Best I know some native browns where caught as well. I will also say that putting yourself up against some of the finest fisherman is no easy thing, mentally or physically. You put yourself out there and that's more than some would do. I wouldn't do it. To be apart of the USA Fly Fishing Team must really be something. I like the whole Team concept better then some individual who just wants to win no matter what it takes. Good luck with the beat selection next time out.

Fishing beats is luck of the draw.... My first time I ended up with beats 2,8 after 4 kids had fished them before :-X all fish were spooked and came up with no fish

There is something wrong when you tell the organizer what beat you had and you get the look of you f'd. The comp in PA will be pretty fair. It's all wild trout/fingerling stocked venues. The only x factor isthe migration of trout for spawning purposes. I will not fish to spawning fish, even if it means losing. Any competitor that does that should be ashamed of themselves.

Yeah the spawning trout is a major no no! i commend you on your decision there. i think there should be enough non-spawning trout to still keep guys catching fish. If anyone comes in with more than one lunker from a beat I would suspect they went after some spawners.

How do you tell if a trout is spawning?

I'd like to know as well. Ill be up for the finals. It'd be nice to know so i dont go targeting that big spawning brown in my beat.

BTW Chris Lee will be joining me along with Hanner, Galvin, and David Woody. I belive you know Chris, Aaron.

I'm not sure, but this is what I think about the whole Team USA thing. When they are looking for the best of the best and someone gets the "I got stuck in pond scum look on there face and then fishes that way". Well if you're that person either you're done or you suck it up and fish your a** off to support your teammates. It's a team sport and hopefully if you're a real team you'll pull each other through the pond scum with maybe one fish. Maybe not. But one fish in a beat that other teams will fish with that I got pond scum attitude and maybe came up empty, you might have caught that one fish that makes a difference for your team. It might make more of a difference than on a easy beat with 20. Just a thought.

As far as the spawning. It's too bad the team itself didn't have more control as to when the event was held. Seems there is more to outside groups running the show than anyone knows. Good to know that you won't do anything you can to win and have some ethics. Sounds like a USA fly fisherman to me. Best of luck at the comp.

About the ethics deal, I have had someone, who is in thecomp tell me that they have no qualms about fishing to spawning fish and that they would force feed them if they had to ie. lining. When I heard this I wanted to throw up. Shit like that is what gives it a bad name.

I fished the beat with 1,000 percent effort. It was not until the comp was over that I found out that I had the perverbial graveyard! I didn't know better, since I was unfamiliar with that wate. I even crossed that raging river because I wanted a fish so bad! That was the most exhausted that I have ever been after fishing for such a short period of time. I was stealthy and everything for not even a nibble!

Well that sucks! And Sorry to hear that. Do you know how they pick the beats? Anyway whay do you want to be a part of this picture. Doesn't sound what it's cracked up to be.

No it's really not. They try to keep the team to themselves. They have a point system in place to ensure that. Yes they might have 15 people on the team but the same 5 people will keep on going to the Wold Championships. They aren't even filling the competitions that they have. There really isn't too much interest in it. I will tell you that I have learned a lot of great techniques in order to compete. I thought it was this really neat thing until I realized what it was. It's a lot of money and time with little or no return on your investment. I could have went on another kickass trip if I didn't go to New Mexico. If I win PA I will go to Poland and that will be it unless I place well there. I really have no desire to travel across the country to fish in another qualifier. I really had zero fun there. I would have rather fished the Rio Chama or San Juan or even driven to CO to fish the Taylor or Frying Pan... That's more fun if you ask me. The whole team thing is an illusion. I would rather keep this site up and do the classes and guide trips as well as write articles. I think that I am giving back more to something that I love by doing what I am doing now.

Well this will be my last post on this matter. I don't like mulling on things I don't have a really understanding of. YOu made it to Nationals which is quite an accomplishmment. You are on a team even if you aren't all famous yet. Seems to me you get the team together and you share all of what you learned and fish your hearts out like a team and that will represent who you really are and what Team USA should be about. There is the scream in one but the roar of more. This should be something people should be interested in. NM may have not been your cup of tea but every experience should bring something into your pool of knowledge. I'd love any excuse to go anywhere to fish. Even with the tumbleweeds! LOL! Maybe you should have used roadrunner feathers in your flies. LOL!!

Well if it comes down to choosing between competing and continuing to run this site, teaching fly fishing and guiding - I'd vote for the later.

Your enthusiasm, expertise and this site has helped more people than you know, myself included. Thank you!

Aaron,

Remember l told you in the past that it takes a very special mind set to deal with competitive FF events. There will be days you win and others you loose, no matter how good you are at catching fish when you are placed in a beat that gives you the opportunity to do so or you make the best of a bad one.

The difference is that when you go fish you can choose where you wish to fish, when fishing events that is not the case, unless you are fishing stillwaters, you have the same freedom as all other anglers, so here there is no excuse for finding yourself placed in a bad beat.
It amounts totally down to your skill level and knowledge of stillwater fishing.

I have fished many events on stillwaters that l knew like the back of my hand, there were days the fish would not play the game, even for the best of the best out there fishing.
When you have some 60 to 80 anglers fishing and less than 10 fish are boated, then you accept that it is part of the game.

So far as what it may cost you personally to compete at events, you just have to suck that unless you can find a sponsor, again its part of the deal here, wish l had the money back l had invested over the years.
And that includes loss of income for the days l was away from the business.

Days when you know you have fished well and find your self in the top league of catch return are great, and so also those when you win your medals, but they are for both the team and yourself at the end of the day a very personal issue, as few others out side of the comp scene would care.

The BS that goes with it is something you have to accept, that's how it is.
If you let that aggravate you then the odds are your fishing will suffer at the end of the day.

Will competitive fishing make you a better angler, l would say at the end of the day yes, no argument about that, for the reasons that you will or should be fishing with far more intent than you would otherwise.
As you know Aaron l am that way period when it comes to fishing, l am a very intense person when it comes to that, it is for me my personal competitive attitude, it matters not to me what others may think.
I fish with a absolute determination given the choice l have made at that time with the technique of choice.

At the end of the day you are but one representing a team, be it at club or National level, and one must always bear that in mind.
Your secrets to success must be shared with them, and others with you, regardless, for if you have the attitude otherwise you should not be a team member.

When you fish as a individual for a team place that is a very different matter, in this case you shut up.

Davy

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